Posted by Nightbreed at ns.west.com on November 26, 1999 at 17:45:15:
In Reply to: my Christian understanding- a definative answer posted by the new guy on November 26, 1999 at 17:15:56:
: The Old Testament is full of "fire and brimstone" and "the wrath of God" and the like. Bartleby and Loki are products of that time and Loki's "occupation" was a product of that time. When God sent his Son (the big J.C.) down to die for our sins...Loki's job became obsolete.
Actually, according to the movie, Loki's defiance was the reason for his exile. It is suggested in the movie that because God's love for Loki was the reason he was never replaced. Not because he was made obsolete.
: Why would God need a servant to issue His/Her wrath, when He's already forgiven everyone's sins. In Romans it says "it is not by our works that we are saved, but by our faith". Actually that brings up a huge issue I have with the Catholic Church...Jesus's death cleansed us of our sin, so how can a plenary indulgance clean us more? but i digress...
If the death of Jesus were like a broom that swept away all Sin, then why do people kill? Why do people steal? In the Catholic faith, parishoners go to Confession to be forgiven for the sins they have committed. While this could be a one-time thing (absolution during last rights), it is part of the regular practice within the catholic church to be absolved during confession. It is the nature of man to sin. It is the desire of the Catholic to repent and be absolved of those sins.
: When Bartleby's wings were cut off, he became human... and as such was priviledge to all the benfits of humanity. In his final moments, I got the distinct feeling that his faith was restored...therefore, if Jesus was telling the truth, Barleby would be accepted into heaven.
Since this movie is about Catholicism, and Catholic dogma, you have to use the Catholic Church as the base of reference. Plenary Indulgence grants the Papacy the right to make laws on earth that will be honored in heaven. In this case, the Church used its ability to forgive sins to all who walked through the church. It was an automatic thing, walk in, you're forgiven. However, since Bartleby and Loki neither walked into the church, nor was it blatently obvious that God forgave them. There is no reasonalble proof to assume that they were granted admittance past the pearly gates.
And I've got 12 years of being an Athiest, and a non-biased viewpoint to back it up.